Sniper decloaking in test 2816

Noticed that now snipers decloak briefly after firing. Not sure I like the change; it really crimps their use for slipping them behind enemy lines. They get offed very quickly unless they’re being covered by other units, which more or less just makes them expensive riflemen.

After this replay get posted : viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1063
Nemo heavily nerfed snipers, decloak after shoot is not the good solution I think. I suggested decloack of sniper when they packed close together.

Frankly I thought the soundwave cue was enough - send out a scout to smoke him out (I’ve ambushed snipers with scouts and taken them out Dirty Harry-style; either that or once visible a couple MG nests open up on the guy and that’s it), drop artillery on the spot (Nebelwerfer salvo is my personal preference), or just drive a vehicle over.

If you’re not paying attention to what’s hitting your troops, snipers are SUPPOSED to make a mess of your infantry and artillery positions:

badassoftheweek.com/zaitsev.html

badassoftheweek.com/pavlichenko.html

badassoftheweek.com/hayha.html

Sniper cloak is crap anyway , that allows mean tactics like with other cloaked units like old AT_infantry (sneaked 2 your base and megakill) or partisans (cheapscout , in masses unstoppable).

Partisans aren’t all they’re cracked up to be. Keep some assault squads and maybe some dug-in MGs around your rear areas and that’ll fix the problem real quick (I tend to keep a fair number of tanks and vehicles in reserve; anything sneaking into my base is going to get one nasty welcome). Strategy games are about anticipating problems from units like that and dealing with them.

And as far as “mean” tactics, well … what do you expect, hot tea rather than hot lead? :no4:

JAL, it is obvious tiger88 doesn’t play multiplayer very often. Mass partisans is absolutely unstoppable, and if you don’t trust me I invite you to play in multiplayer with us.

I object. mass partisans are near worthless, I was playing multi player with a friend, Britain versus russia, he spammed partisans and all I did was deploy some vickers mgs around my base combined with scouts and bam he couldn’t break through no matter what

Watch this replay tasdownloads.com/uploads/map … geRevX.sd7
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Use the “ambush” command for partisans !!!

I don’t have the internet time for MP games, but I will test out some partisan rushes in SP. My guess is that they can be foiled with proper tactics.

To bring the topic back to the sniper: here’s an idea. I can make the change to script so that sniper does not lose cloak after the shot, but has decloak range increased (say +50% after each shot). If he’s not shooting for some time, the range will reset back to normal. This way he can make 2-3 shots (take out not deployed machinegunner for ex.) without being detected, but he has to stop firing/change position after that, or he will be discovered.
This gives the sniper 2 roles - marksman (goes among normal infantry, shoots constantly, does not hide, relies on protection from other units) and sniper (can get behind enemy lines and kill something important, but not slaughter masses of inf from cover).

I used partisan spam yesterday , can post the replay.

for sniper, i took off cloaking on my mutator and increased their range by +100 that way they can be cost effective killing brens,mortars & MG (i increased damage vs sandbags +200).

But u cant sneak behind enemy lines . They r not commando.

+1.
They could be made abit cheaper aswell in my opinion.

The soundwave animation already has that effect; once they fire all you have to do is scroll over to where your infantry are getting hit, wait for another bulls-eye to appear, and then either move a scout in or grid the spot with something that goes bang. The only way a sniper can massacre infantry is if you don’t have either option handy or are just plumb not paying attention.

As far as “partisan swarming” … what version are you talking about? With the current test versions you’d need to drop a lot of supply points well inside your own lines or someplace well away from the enemy; otherwise in order to build up more than a few dozen of them you’d be waiting around until your opponent has already shredded you the old-fashioned way. Frankly that’s the way they should stay - nuisance/area denial units rather than a Zergling-type swarming unit.

That requires your undevided attention and the enemy might have more scouts than you while the game is still in the infantry stage and then there isn’t much to counter a cloaked sniper backed up by infantry and scouts.

Mortars do a treat there. And at the “infantry stage,” if your opponent is spending heavily on snipers he’s probably giving up an edge in infantry. If he’s trying to protect his snipers with infantry that a) pretty much removes the logic of making them cloaked units when they have to be surrounded by uncloaked ones and b) is contrary to sniper usage. Squads then and today may employ “designated marksmen,” but a fully trained sniper is supposed to be out there alone, one guy with a rifle tying up forty times the number of enemies.

At present, the micromanagement is all on the side of the player using snipers; he has to go around and move the bloody things ever couple of shots. In 2816 I hardly even bother producing them, because I can get more use out of setting up MGs and mortars with my infantry and don’t have to constantly babysit them.

I think snipers are abit overpowered if they stay completly cloaked when they fire(although they are abit underpowered/overpriced when they uncloak).

This is mostly map dependant but snipers with scouts infront of them, infantry and AT-guns behind them are almost unstoppable. Mortars is propably the best counter except using own snipers but it is easy to move the snipers once you hear incoming mortar shells, ammo is limited and if you move the mortars too close, the snipers can easily take them out.

Currently snipers can almost only be used in conjunction with other infantry because they decloak when they fire.

I agree that snipers now are almost useless if they are alone. Yuritch solution might be an interesting as it goes inbeetween always cloaked or decloaked when they fire.

Actually, here’s another idea - what about making snipers morphable? We can leave them as they are now, but add a tab that will morph them relatively quickly (faster than an MG) into a fixed, camouflaged hide or “spider hole” that can remain cloaked while firing and have a decloak radius comparable to a scout. That would allow them to fire unseen, but you’d still be able to see the red ripples on the map and either send units or indirect fire that way - and the sniper would then have a hard time getting away fast enough. Plus it would also have a fixed firing arc, like a deployed MG, allowing infantry or scouts to flank the sniper and cut him down.

I quite like this idea :slight_smile:

In general snipers are usually ghillied up and hunkered down in one spot anyway - they aren’t running around the battlefield.

For WW2, that is not correct for all Factions. A simple description of the differences can be found here:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sniper#World_War_II

As shown us snipers aren’t trained in camouflage at all, while german and soviet snipers was especially trained to fight like “invisible” threats to the enemy.

wbr
ralle