get rid of cloaked stuff & more LoS

So many cloaked stuff , isnt it anoying. (specialy sniper) ?

for scout - give sight 1000, no cloak
for sniper - give range 1000-1200 ,more damage vs nests, no cloak
for AT - more range for Bazooka/Panzerschreck , RPG43 & PIAT & panzerfaust cheaper with smg. RPG43 should move like any rifle infantry,no cloak

for arty guide , scout cant sneak around anymore, scout vehicle and/or scout tanks with 1200/1600 sight .

No idea for partisan right now. (could be abused as cloaked scout)

While I agree that cloaked units are not great, having very large sight ranges on large numbers of units is at least equally bad, and often worse.

Will explain more when I have more time.

I don’t know if a already wrote that (really cant remeber) but you can see the healthbars / buildbars of cloaked buildings… had this on a Gundam map with russian buildings…

Okay, now that I have a moment:

The more a team can see, the more Lanchester’s Square law of relative strength applies. Namely, a force’s ‘power’ in a confrontation with perfect information where long ranged weapons (such as tank guns or rifles) are involved, is roughly n^2, where n is the number of units in the force.

In more specific terms, the easier it is to get LoS, the more quickly slippery slope develops once one team achieves numerical superiority at a particular tech level.

Basically given the size of our maps, throwing around 1000-1200 size LoS will make any kind of flanking or big repositioning movement pretty much pointless, since you’d know that most of the map would be in enemy LoS most of the time.

You can only flank in early game because your oponent has not enough ifnantry build 2 cover all flanks, but later its impossible if the game is still even.

With machine gun spam i get enough scouts 2 see all sides of frontline.

Others do sniper spam.

Cloaked Snipers make any defense(MG’s/Gun’s) usesless.

Hi everyone!
I want to say that cloaked staff is horrible! All unites should have visibility, spotting range and spotting ability. Sniper when moving should be of course more viable then when he’s standing. So when men is moving he should be seen by others people by not as good by tank because it should have lower spotting ability. In that case infantry would be needed to protect armor. Now AT kills the tank before anyone see it what doesn’t make sense…

And one more – not suppressed tank should see more because man can watch the area with binoculars from hatch. When anyone is shooting he should hide to the tank…

If it’s to much - sorry I want to help.

Much of that would be nice, but is not currently possible with the Spring engine.

I played with 2x LoS , several games and it worked fine , gameplay made more fun , i could use arty ,tanks and planes better at frontline.

For the slippery slope thing, Godde flanked me in one of the 2x LoS games, rare that i had so much fun by losing xD .I think its practical not so dramatic only in theoretical.

But i think it would be more realistic and even better if special units give the better LoS , so that u can make the enemy blind before u do something risky.

Special units? Like a watch tower that can be taken out easily?
People need to use more smoke shells. Maybe the duration could be longer than 12 seconds.

Would you like a smoke duration modoption to test?

Thats a treat.
It would be nice if smoke had more potential. Right now I can only think about a few situations were smoke would be better than HE shells and smoke is rarely used. I imagine smoke being better only when you want to stop tanks from firing accurately or if you want to close in on them with other units. To use smoke against artillery, vehicles or infantry when you could suppress and actually KILL them with HE shells seems like a waste.

If the smoke lasted longer it would propably be a better short term counter against artillery while vehicles and infantry could be rendered harmless in small areas.

I don’t know the historical use of smoke.

Well, much of the historical use is to put a smoke screen between your forces and the enemy to mask your movements. Not really feasible with Spring’s current LoS system.

rev 2779 for duration mult. Would radius be useful too? Only problem is i’m not sure how the visuals are linked to radius.

If a smoke cloud stay for a longer time it also means that 1 cannon can put a larger area in smoke. So if 1 smoke shell covers twice the area or lasts twice as long it should have the same impact.
There is offcourse the chance that the cannon hits the same spot just as before and then a larger area compared to longer duration would be beneficial since the smoke fades faster.

Even if smoke blocked LoS there is little room with standard sight and weapon ranges for smoke to be effective to mask movements.
If smoke screens should be effective to aim beetween armies units have to be unable to fire accuratly through the smoke.

Tanks having smoke grenedes for “personal” use which have been mentioned before could be useful as smoke works now. Combined with hold fire it would be very useful. Using artillery or mortars to make smokescreens for advancement or retreat seems tidious and innefficient.

Why smoke vs arty they dont do direct fire and dont see their target personally. Scouts see for them.

Not Watchtower , i am thinking about real scouting units .

I think , the game should have a attractive gameplay , lots of rts players like WWII games , but we dont get (or cant hold) players at s44. I think the cloaked stuff and low LoS doesnt make the game attractive .

Look what Pepek wrote , yesterday i played vs newbe , he said this mod is hard 2 play . You really want reverse LoS ?

Why did i shoot before MG , Nemo scared me before he left .
Plz no reverso LoS for normal mode.

Did they use smoke to blind units in WW2?
My point is that the only good use for smoke shells in s44 is to blind tanks. If the smoke lasted longer it could be an alternative to HE shells against infantry, vehicles and arty.

Thats how arty was used.

This doesn’t tell anything about how smoke was used. On another note.
What if artillery could only be ordered to fire in the vicinity off special units like scouts and other faction specific spotting units?
So that you would need a scout that ordered the barrage in vicinity off the targeting sight.

I remember in Warzone 2100 (old RTS game, its free now) u could assign arty to any unit , and arty will shoot at the same target as the unit.

The game had a commander unit too , u could assign fighting units to it and they will attack all the same unit .

Some nice ideas there.